39-72V寬范圍輸入電壓,輸出24V/500W,隔離式通信模塊電源,開關(guān)頻率200KHz,使用什么拓?fù)湫什拍茏罡吣?
1.PWM全橋+同步整流.較低的輸入電壓下移相全橋可能沒有什么優(yōu)勢(shì),甚至環(huán)流的存在可能使效率降低,LLC半橋可能也是如此;
2.推挽正激+同步整流.這是一種新的電路拓?fù)?但未見實(shí)際的產(chǎn)品設(shè)計(jì);
3.兩級(jí)結(jié)構(gòu)Buck+開環(huán)全橋+同步整流.效率上不知道有無優(yōu)勢(shì),不過采用更多器件,成本自然就上去了;
有沒有人實(shí)際做過類似的設(shè)計(jì)?討論一下各種拓?fù)涞膬?yōu)、缺點(diǎn).
500W隔離式DC/DC模塊電源
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@斜陽古道
這么大的功率,并且是一個(gè)全磚,用有源鉗位的話,磁芯利用率不太高、原邊電流太大,使用兩象限拓?fù)淇赡芨线m一點(diǎn)...關(guān)注的是效率與成本.樓上的,你這700W在48V輸入時(shí)能做到多大的效率?另外,你的輸出也是24V?
Hi, A FB/500W should be not too hard, you had better forcus on cost! The most curent products are 700W/SR, and they are all focus on the efficiency. You can refer to ERICSON, SYNQOR, DELTA and POWER ONE.
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@斜陽古道
各位朋友,其實(shí)我并不是要做產(chǎn)品設(shè)計(jì),只是關(guān)注模塊電源這個(gè)方面的設(shè)計(jì),怎樣才是效率較高的電路拓?fù)?同時(shí)成本又不太高?還是覺得“兩級(jí)結(jié)構(gòu)Buck+開環(huán)全橋+同步整流”的效率應(yīng)該最好,Temp1234講這是Synqor的專利?可以貼出這個(gè)專利或給出專利號(hào)嗎?謝謝
Synqor has around 20 patents for these types, cover Interleave Forward, Push-Pull, HB and FB topoligrs!
For your reference:11/16/2007
SynQor Announces Patent Infringement Lawsuit
Boxborough, MA - November 16th 2007 - SynQor announced today that it filed a lawsuit against several of its competitors for infringement of three patents relating to bus converters and/or non-isolated point of load converters used in intermediate bus architectures. The patents at issue are U.S. patents 7,072,190, 7,272,021, and 7,269,034. The suit was filed in Federal Court in the Eastern District of Texas.
The defendants in the action are Artesyn Technologies, Inc., Astec America, Inc., Emerson Electric, Co., Bel Fuse Inc., Cherokee International Corp., Delta Electronics, Inc., Delta Products Corp., Murata Manufacturing Co., Ltd., Murata Electronics North America, Inc., Power-One, Inc., Tyco Electronics Corp., and Tyco Electronics Ltd.
Sidley Austin LLP will be representing SynQor in this litigation.
For your reference:11/16/2007
SynQor Announces Patent Infringement Lawsuit
Boxborough, MA - November 16th 2007 - SynQor announced today that it filed a lawsuit against several of its competitors for infringement of three patents relating to bus converters and/or non-isolated point of load converters used in intermediate bus architectures. The patents at issue are U.S. patents 7,072,190, 7,272,021, and 7,269,034. The suit was filed in Federal Court in the Eastern District of Texas.
The defendants in the action are Artesyn Technologies, Inc., Astec America, Inc., Emerson Electric, Co., Bel Fuse Inc., Cherokee International Corp., Delta Electronics, Inc., Delta Products Corp., Murata Manufacturing Co., Ltd., Murata Electronics North America, Inc., Power-One, Inc., Tyco Electronics Corp., and Tyco Electronics Ltd.
Sidley Austin LLP will be representing SynQor in this litigation.
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@temp1234
Synqorhasaround20patentsforthesetypes,coverInterleaveForward,Push-Pull,HBandFBtopoligrs!Foryourreference:11/16/2007SynQorAnnouncesPatentInfringementLawsuitBoxborough,MA-November16th2007-SynQorannouncedtodaythatitfiledalawsuitagainstseveralofitscompetitorsforinfringementofthreepatentsrelatingtobusconvertersand/ornon-isolatedpointofloadconvertersusedinintermediatebusarchitectures.ThepatentsatissueareU.S.patents7,072,190,7,272,021,and7,269,034.ThesuitwasfiledinFederalCourtintheEasternDistrictofTexas.ThedefendantsintheactionareArtesynTechnologies,Inc.,AstecAmerica,Inc.,EmersonElectric,Co.,BelFuseInc.,CherokeeInternationalCorp.,DeltaElectronics,Inc.,DeltaProductsCorp.,MurataManufacturingCo.,Ltd.,MurataElectronicsNorthAmerica,Inc.,Power-One,Inc.,TycoElectronicsCorp.,andTycoElectronicsLtd.SidleyAustinLLPwillberepresentingSynQorinthislitigation.
"Artesyn Technologies, Inc., Astec America, Inc., Emerson Electric, Co., ..."
Yeah, I knowed the patent fight. But I believe there some differences between the competitors and Synqor. For example, what SynQor announced were mainly the bus converters. But we can only do very small change. It should be a appropriate strategy.
Thank for your information.
Yeah, I knowed the patent fight. But I believe there some differences between the competitors and Synqor. For example, what SynQor announced were mainly the bus converters. But we can only do very small change. It should be a appropriate strategy.
Thank for your information.
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@斜陽古道
"ArtesynTechnologies,Inc.,AstecAmerica,Inc.,EmersonElectric,Co.,..."Yeah,Iknowedthepatentfight.ButIbelievetheresomedifferencesbetweenthecompetitorsandSynqor.Forexample,whatSynQorannouncedweremainlythebusconverters.Butwecanonlydoverysmallchange.Itshouldbeaappropriatestrategy.Thankforyourinformation.
OK! Synqor's Ideas are using a step-down feed-back form secondary to regualtion owrking-voltage(or bus-voltage) and then using 50/50 ratio DC transformer to direct divide target output voltage to secondary! This stage has many versions, which cover Interleave Forward, Push-Pull, HB and FB. Using "電流型" so the smooth chock is in primary side. due to the Dc transformer stage, synqor suit his compitors. It's conceptial Infringement, so it will take long time to fighting!
I hate typing, so every time I try fewest word to explain it!
I hate typing, so every time I try fewest word to explain it!
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@temp1234
OK!Synqor'sIdeasareusingastep-downfeed-backformsecondarytoregualtionowrking-voltage(orbus-voltage)andthenusing50/50ratioDCtransformertodirectdividetargetoutputvoltagetosecondary!Thisstagehasmanyversions,whichcoverInterleaveForward,Push-Pull,HBandFB.Using"電流型"sothesmoothchockisinprimaryside.duetotheDctransformerstage,synqorsuithiscompitors.It'sconceptialInfringement,soitwilltakelongtimetofighting!Ihatetyping,soeverytimeItryfewestwordtoexplainit!
No, no..., you should do it to share others your ideas and thoughts. Thanks a lot.
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@斜陽古道
No,no...,youshoulddoittoshareothersyourideasandthoughts.Thanksalot.
OK! Now you know, Why Synqor suits everyone have bus-converter without secondary output chock! And after this matter, you see the competitors propose their new 5% regulation type of bus-converter with output-chock.
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@temp1234
OK!Nowyouknow,WhySynqorsuitseveryonehavebus-converterwithoutsecondaryoutputchock!Andafterthismatter,youseethecompetitorsproposetheirnew5%regulationtypeofbus-converterwithoutput-chock.
Great, bus converter with output filtering inductor is a very clever approach not to violate Synqor's patents.
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@michael_xu
在39-72V低壓輸出的情況下,并且開關(guān)頻率只有200kHz,LLC半橋(全橋)和移相全橋均沒有優(yōu)勢(shì).反而有可能造成通態(tài)損耗增加.在正激,半橋,全橋的拓?fù)渲?選擇,全橋做500W這個(gè)功率等級(jí)最優(yōu)優(yōu)勢(shì).在同樣的磁芯利用率的情況下,全橋原邊電流比半橋小,有效占空比比正激大,因此輸出電感比正激小,Vin=39-72V,Vo=24V/21A,如果用同步整流,用全橋硬開關(guān)在半磚上做,48V滿載效率應(yīng)該能做到95%.
同意樓上的說法,或許還可以嘗試一下交錯(cuò)并聯(lián)的PWM硬開關(guān)全橋,同時(shí)也可以考慮副邊繞組串聯(lián)加同步整流的方式.
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@buckbuckbuck
其實(shí)最高效率的拓?fù)錄]有出現(xiàn)在你們的討論中,它是兩級(jí)結(jié)構(gòu)的DeltaBoost+交錯(cuò)LLC,估計(jì)見到過的也沒幾個(gè).以色列出品.同志們還需努力啊,優(yōu)秀的拓?fù)湓O(shè)計(jì)是一門藝術(shù),而藝術(shù)家很少,所以并不是每個(gè)人都適合做這一行
boost+交錯(cuò)LLC,做到48V滿載效率到95%以上應(yīng)該也有難度.我沒有看到過你說的產(chǎn)品.首先boost從48V到75V以上這一級(jí)效率就不容易做到98.5%以上.當(dāng)然兩級(jí)方案可以考慮,比如說前級(jí)用單電感的buck-boost,從48V輸入到48輸出左右,效率應(yīng)該能優(yōu)化到98.5%左右.第二級(jí)采用,LLC全橋的2:1轉(zhuǎn)換到24V左右,效率能盡量做到97以上,總之整體效率要能超過96%很難.
目前看到的產(chǎn)品,可以參照synqor的1/4brick,300W產(chǎn)品,第一級(jí)用buck電路,將Vin=36-75轉(zhuǎn)換到Vbus=36-48V,第二級(jí)用boost隔離型全橋,將Vbus36--48V調(diào)整到輸出Vo=12/25A.兩級(jí)都是在Vin=48點(diǎn)取得最高效率.因此整體效率做到最高.但兩級(jí)都調(diào)整帶來動(dòng)態(tài)性能不好,等等問題.
目前看到的產(chǎn)品,可以參照synqor的1/4brick,300W產(chǎn)品,第一級(jí)用buck電路,將Vin=36-75轉(zhuǎn)換到Vbus=36-48V,第二級(jí)用boost隔離型全橋,將Vbus36--48V調(diào)整到輸出Vo=12/25A.兩級(jí)都是在Vin=48點(diǎn)取得最高效率.因此整體效率做到最高.但兩級(jí)都調(diào)整帶來動(dòng)態(tài)性能不好,等等問題.
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@temp1234
TwostageTopologiesarelessefficiencythanthesinglestageTopologies!Nomatterithasboost,orbuck!Youcanseebread-newEricsson's400WQBcanreach95.5%on12V/33A!(it'sahard-switchFB+SR).Actuallytwostage'sadvantageisonmore-widerinputrangenotforbetterefficiency!OK!hereis:http://www.ericsson.com/campaign/powermodules/hp/BMR_453.htm
why? Ericsson'400W QB reach 95.5%, I cannot see the module from the website. I guest, it's a bus converter or Vin=36-60V range module.
I've not see any module which can reach 96% at Vin=36-75V,Vo=12/25A in QBrick except SynQor's two stage module.
actually I ever tested SynQor's module, it has the best efficiency at Vin=48V.
I've not see any module which can reach 96% at Vin=36-75V,Vo=12/25A in QBrick except SynQor's two stage module.
actually I ever tested SynQor's module, it has the best efficiency at Vin=48V.
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@michael_xu
boost+交錯(cuò)LLC,做到48V滿載效率到95%以上應(yīng)該也有難度.我沒有看到過你說的產(chǎn)品.首先boost從48V到75V以上這一級(jí)效率就不容易做到98.5%以上.當(dāng)然兩級(jí)方案可以考慮,比如說前級(jí)用單電感的buck-boost,從48V輸入到48輸出左右,效率應(yīng)該能優(yōu)化到98.5%左右.第二級(jí)采用,LLC全橋的2:1轉(zhuǎn)換到24V左右,效率能盡量做到97以上,總之整體效率要能超過96%很難.目前看到的產(chǎn)品,可以參照synqor的1/4brick,300W產(chǎn)品,第一級(jí)用buck電路,將Vin=36-75轉(zhuǎn)換到Vbus=36-48V,第二級(jí)用boost隔離型全橋,將Vbus36--48V調(diào)整到輸出Vo=12/25A.兩級(jí)都是在Vin=48點(diǎn)取得最高效率.因此整體效率做到最高.但兩級(jí)都調(diào)整帶來動(dòng)態(tài)性能不好,等等問題.
Two stage Topologies are less efficiency than the single stage Topologies!No matter it has boost, or buck! You can see bread-new Ericsson's 400W QB can reach 95.5% on 12V/33A!(it's a hard-switch FB+SR). Actually two stage's advantage is on more-wider input range not for better efficiency!
OK! here is :http://www.ericsson.com/campaign/powermodules/hp/BMR_453.htm
OK! here is :http://www.ericsson.com/campaign/powermodules/hp/BMR_453.htm
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